tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post3096923388680239586..comments2024-03-26T15:35:56.004-04:00Comments on Delta's D&D Hotspot: Cursed Magic Items Through the AgesDeltahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comBlogger16125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-22294954908031521722022-04-29T16:09:24.652-04:002022-04-29T16:09:24.652-04:00Woe, I actually kind of like that mechanic. I ofte...Woe, I actually kind of like that mechanic. I often wish classic D&D had a similar mechanic for formalizing alignment status (other than just DM fiat). Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-82059161153603209382022-04-28T14:20:01.626-04:002022-04-28T14:20:01.626-04:00Yup. Adventurer's Vault is more or less the 4t...Yup. Adventurer's Vault is more or less the 4th core book for 4E. The magic items in the PH are a pretty small selection.<br /><br />Since you also mentioned Artifacts in your 1E write-up, you might be interested to hear that artifacts in 4E also have pros and cons. Perhaps not as extreme as in 1E, but the DM is expected to track a Concordance score for an artifact and wielder. Any time you act in ways the artifact likes, the score increases. And when you do things it doesn't like, it decrements. The benefits and powers of the item you have access to grow or shrink in accord with this score, and IIRC if it goes low enough, can include curse-like effects, depending on the item.Shimrodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14950780684532279227noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-38249458395576615882022-02-20T23:54:20.434-05:002022-02-20T23:54:20.434-05:00(And due to rounding, the LBB & Sup-I frequenc...(And due to rounding, the LBB & Sup-I frequencies still show the same 8% and 13% respectively.)Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-13413162023187659182022-02-20T23:47:07.505-05:002022-02-20T23:47:07.505-05:00That's a good point, I guess I missed the orig...That's a good point, I guess I missed the original Helm of Chaos/Law. Like you, I struggled with the Mirror of Life Trapping -- a signal I used in those cases was to turn to the 1E DMG, and see it was given positive values for both XP & sale value, indicating it was considered to be a useful/non-cursed item. Agreed on the swords, too.<br /><br />I'm updating my spreadsheet to add the Helm of Chaos/Law. Thanks for that!Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-77826153734913724772022-02-20T19:51:18.393-05:002022-02-20T19:51:18.393-05:00This is coming in months late, but anyhow.
I'...This is coming in months late, but anyhow.<br /><br />I'd argue that the LBBs have *one* cursed miscellaneous item, the Helm of Chaos (Law). However, well, even though it's 11% of the Miscellaneous Magic table that just adds +0.55% to the total.<br /><br />Incidentally, you've got a 9% chance of getting an uncursed magical helmet and an 11% chance of getting one that'll forcibly change your alignment, so I'd recommend against just randomly wearing magical helmets in an LBB-only game.<br /><br />There's also the curious case of the Mirror of Life Trapping, which is very useful should the players acquire it but is also basically just a trap. +0.05% if you decide to count it, I guess.<br /><br />LBB magic swords also have some weirdness going on in how they'll damage people of other alignments and try to take over their wielders, but I'd put them in the same broad category as Greyhawk's magical tomes.Neveronhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06290575926119589773noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-27806505292607117822021-11-27T19:59:55.637-05:002021-11-27T19:59:55.637-05:00I like that a lot! And thanks for the kind words. ...I like that a lot! And thanks for the kind words. :-)<br /><br />What is that 13th Warrior carrying, anyway!?Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-66036089729864670322021-11-26T11:41:42.130-05:002021-11-26T11:41:42.130-05:00This is a good analysis, Dan...very interesting, e...This is a good analysis, Dan...very interesting, even to just consider the percentages of "bad" items found in the game.<br /><br />I went through my own adventures (that I've written), and looks like I go between 7% and 10% on the cursed items. For the most part, I don't do random stocking of dungeons, and I prefer "double-edged" items (ones that can be useful in some instances: a berserker blade or potion of poison, for example), but 7% is probably a good number. Works out to about 1 in 13, and shouldn't the 13th magic item found ALWAYS be some sort of cursed/bad juju enchantment?<br />; )JBhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03263662621289630246noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-67829424208881023952021-11-24T19:20:19.820-05:002021-11-24T19:20:19.820-05:00Thanks for those details! AS I've now been tol...Thanks for those details! AS I've now been told, most 4E DMs apparently consider the Adventurer's Vault supplement indispensable, but admittedly it's not something I've looked at.Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-57685126227081227522021-11-24T19:18:40.841-05:002021-11-24T19:18:40.841-05:00Good stuff, thanks for that. Totally agreed that c...Good stuff, thanks for that. Totally agreed that cursed items make more sense as mistakes than intended design (which is why I want to incorporate a chance in the general crafting rules). On of these editions also expanded on possibilities of: time passing, touched by evil creatures, infected by high-magic locations, etc., which all makes sense (and argues for higher ratio of found items than newly created). Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-36770124012805515992021-11-24T19:15:56.153-05:002021-11-24T19:15:56.153-05:00Yeah, having browsed over the relevant pages in th...Yeah, having browsed over the relevant pages in this search, 2E had explicit and detailed rules for that (crafted items coming up cursed), but I don't think any other edition generally did.<br /><br />1E has a chance of scroll failure (simply ruined; e.g. 13%), and a footnote-alternative to give 5-20% chance for potions to come out delusional. The enchant an item spell gives a flat 1-in-20 chance for failure (no cursed option noted).Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-6653272950197410592021-11-23T00:58:35.008-05:002021-11-23T00:58:35.008-05:00For 2E, I would adjust down to 9.67% if we take in...For 2E, I would adjust down to 9.67% if we take into account that a roll of 20 on any subtable results in "DM's choice" - but it's a small difference in any case. You are correct that the "generic" cursed -1 weapons don't force you to wield them. That's called out as a specific property of the Cursed +1 Sword, Cursed Berserking Sword, and Cursed -2 Sword. The main inconvenience of the unnamed cursed armaments is that with the reduced economics of 2E, the 100 gold piece cost of the Identify spell combined with its uncertain chance of success make it an expensive prospect at low levels, so players might be running around using unidentified magical weapons and armor for some time before they realize it's actually cursed.<br /><br />For 4E, I would put 0% with an asterisk - in the main magic item book, Adventurer's Vault, there is one cursed suit of armor. That alone plus the magic items in the PHB puts it below 1% to begin with, and further books introduced magic items without adding more cursed items. So if official support for the edition continued indefinitely, then the limit of the proportion of cursed items as the number of magic items went to infinity would be zero.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14285793254382192231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-14705030715303255992021-11-22T19:13:16.316-05:002021-11-22T19:13:16.316-05:00To the extent that I’ve used ‘cursed’ magic items,...To the extent that I’ve used ‘cursed’ magic items, they’ve been normal magic items that malfunction, either consistently or intermittently. <br /><br />It always seemed unlikely to me that a wizard would put in the time and treasure needed to create a magic item, then add more work to give it deleterious effects, and still more to make it impossible to discard and so on, and still MORE to connect the effects to specific character classes or races. A ‘mad wizard’ is the usual justification, but how many wizards are highly skilled, hardworking, focused, rich enough to buy gemstones etc., yet somehow also barking mad? That’s too cheap an excuse. <br /><br />Far more plausibly, to my mind, ‘cursed’ magic items result from fumbles in casting and from incautious experiments by the makers. A fireball wand that fires backwards one time in six is just as good as a curse, and far more believable. <br /><br />Plus, malfunction is better in terms of player agency and narrative tension. Just how desperate is this fight? Bad enough to pull out the Ring of Summoning Demons Who Are Usually Obedient But Not Quite Always? How about the Ring of Inaccurate Teleportation?<br /><br />The only exception, I think, is in tying artifact-level powers to particular alignments, with curses for any of the maker’s foes who try to use the item. I didn’t use alignment in my own D&D campaigns, but if I had, I’d have been OK with, say, a +5 Holy Avenger sword backfiring on a CE fighter trying to use it. The extra effort to make it would seem justified. I have lots of objections to this approach, mind, but more to the idea of alignment than the to connecting it to magic items.<br /><br />Dominic ‘still unable to register’ BrownUnknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06019386830729019978noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-53160064882092230742021-11-22T14:28:34.776-05:002021-11-22T14:28:34.776-05:00Hmm, Now I want to go back and see the % likelyhoo...Hmm, Now I want to go back and see the % likelyhood of magic item creation resulting in a cursed item in various editions.<br />That said, it looks like the OED 1 in 20 seems generous, but generally in line.Baquieshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08357103428591599364noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-54078880810732961342021-11-22T10:36:50.686-05:002021-11-22T10:36:50.686-05:00That seems very true.That seems very true.Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-17930822723468380462021-11-22T10:31:50.803-05:002021-11-22T10:31:50.803-05:00Honestly it seems to me that "becomes less fr...Honestly it seems to me that "becomes less frequent, and much less punishing over time" describes just about everything in D&D that might negatively affect the characters.Joshua Macyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10838733328132877699noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-72297009949710576912021-11-22T10:19:55.260-05:002021-11-22T10:19:55.260-05:00Thank you for saying that! :-DThank you for saying that! :-DDeltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.com