tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post6440864766809682491..comments2024-03-26T15:35:56.004-04:00Comments on Delta's D&D Hotspot: More Monster Metrics, Pt. 1Deltahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comBlogger21125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-18175391725477963872016-03-24T12:11:36.183-04:002016-03-24T12:11:36.183-04:00Sweet! :-)Sweet! :-)Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-28179924474636569302016-03-24T12:11:18.057-04:002016-03-24T12:11:18.057-04:00That's exactly what I have running in my mind,...That's exactly what I have running in my mind, too. Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-38862384630901752252016-03-24T12:10:34.544-04:002016-03-24T12:10:34.544-04:00Good for you having big party size!Good for you having big party size!Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-61478359084942337792016-03-23T19:46:32.847-04:002016-03-23T19:46:32.847-04:00Funny - I may be one of the few people left in the...Funny - I may be one of the few people left in the world who plays the randomization of melee attacks BTB, so I guess I agree with your rulings there. ;) <br /><br />http://landonsgamenotes.blogspot.com/2016/03/home-brew-rules-for-1st-edition-ad.htmlLWSCHURTZhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06635573516962732975noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-73097475595325041572016-03-23T12:12:59.640-04:002016-03-23T12:12:59.640-04:00Assuming the whole party is in melee and attacks o...Assuming the whole party is in melee and attacks of opportunity don't exist, though, then yeah - getting half of them sounds reasonable. Hell, a green dragon could probably hit the entire party.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14285793254382192231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-58111182935904394722016-03-23T12:05:32.957-04:002016-03-23T12:05:32.957-04:00There is precedent for vampires having to charm pe...There is precedent for vampires having to charm people individually. Just look at Dracula - he only charms Renfield, Lucy, and Mina when he's alone with them. If there's more than one person present, he stays away and bides his time. If he had an AoE charm ability, he could have just charmed Mina's father, Mina, Lucy, and John all at once when he first met them and then the movie would be over.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14285793254382192231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-90414624546039787132016-03-23T11:55:56.721-04:002016-03-23T11:55:56.721-04:00In my main campaign, there's technically a max...In my main campaign, there's technically a max of a dozen, but 7 or 8 is the norm - I get 5 or 6 players, a couple of whom run henchmen as well as their PCs. Generally 4 or 5 of those characters will be in melee with a huge enemy like a dragon.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14285793254382192231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-37261014075264313862016-03-23T11:19:28.310-04:002016-03-23T11:19:28.310-04:00EDH is the HD of the opposing fighter that has a (...<i>EDH is the HD of the opposing fighter that has a (roughly) 50/50 chance to the defeat the monster, right?</i><br /><br />A: It <i>was</i> that in the prior articles. Starting next week, EHD becomes a weighted average of number of HD of opponents needed to beat someone (the average taken over levels 1-12). <br /><br /><i>I would guess that monsters with identical EDH's will have different curves, depending on how the impact of their special abilities scales with the fighter's HD.</i><br /><br />You win the D&D Statistics Award for today! Totally nailed that. One of our primary conclusions was that the D&D 3E formula that doubling monster numbers always increases challenge by +2 steps is very broken in exactly that way. <br /><br />Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-83460672772874090272016-03-23T11:14:03.362-04:002016-03-23T11:14:03.362-04:00Right, I don't mind the existing standard for ...Right, I don't mind the existing standard for charm vs. fear effects too much. Somehow it feels like fear is a repellant, while charm is an injection-of-will (more difficult, and hence requires more focus?). So the fact that the standard spells roll in that direction (charm person/monster vs. 1, fear vs. an area) seems to set a precedent.<br /><br />However, it did force me to think that through initially about whether I was happy with it on implementing the vampires. There's at least a little bit of haziness there.Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-70065586653345458682016-03-23T11:09:04.705-04:002016-03-23T11:09:04.705-04:00How big are your parties, generally? I suppose one...How big are your parties, generally? I suppose one thing in the model here is that all the fighters are melee specialists, so they need to be in close contact with dragon. That rationalizes a bit more the likely hit the half on one side with a cone breath? Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-27433889773993474602016-03-23T07:35:15.946-04:002016-03-23T07:35:15.946-04:00:%s/EDH/EHD/g:%s/EDH/EHD/gpileshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06008654668836414680noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-41959616891966953122016-03-23T07:34:26.151-04:002016-03-23T07:34:26.151-04:00EDH is the HD of the opposing fighter that has a (...EDH is the HD of the opposing fighter that has a (roughly) 50/50 chance to the defeat the monster, right? I was wondering how this probability changes as function of the fighter's HD, the function p(HD) if you like (not to be confused with PhD, although you might want use one of those to plot the functions :)<br /><br />It would give an indication of the threat level for an encounter above/under the HD of the fighter. <br /><br />I would guess that monsters with identical EDH's will have different curves, depending on how the impact of their special abilities scales with the fighter's HD.<br /><br />Similarly, what are the curves of fighter vs. fighter? From these curves you may glean some insight how much stronger a lvl x character is than a lvl y. How much stronger is a 3HD fighter than a 2HD one? And what HD should a fighter have to defeat a 6HD fighter with the same odds? 7HD (1HD difference), 9HD (same ratio as 3/2), or something else entirely? pileshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06008654668836414680noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-9877588940382232912016-03-23T00:54:17.563-04:002016-03-23T00:54:17.563-04:00Yes Daniel on treating gasses as volume-filling un...Yes Daniel on treating gasses as volume-filling unless the effect specifically says otherwise. Although I stick with durations unless magical or otherwise significant wind blows it away. <br /><br />I agree about Vampire Charm, but undead like Liches and Mummies should cause fear to everyone who views them - again, I'm coming at this from a 1E perspective so that probably isn't represented in LBB. Regardless, doesn't it seem strange that a lot of monsters cause area-effect Fear but not area-effect Charm?<br /><br />I had a Naga with a One-Charm-Per-Target-Per-Day thing, but she had to use the ability on one person per round. It's possible that mass fear is acceptable but mass charm is just too powerful! The only place I can remember mass Charm happening is an 8th level M-U spell with a total limit on victims' hit dice equal to double M-U level. A monster that could Charm all onlookers simultaneously would be pretty gnarly. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-18884515164311245362016-03-22T12:51:22.773-04:002016-03-22T12:51:22.773-04:00I think where he's going with the fill-the-cav...I think where he's going with the fill-the-cave idea is along the lines of the AD&D iron golem's poison gas. Specifically, that it will linger in an enclosed area lacking proper ventilation.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14285793254382192231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-19430180245753103322016-03-22T12:47:24.815-04:002016-03-22T12:47:24.815-04:00If possible, then, I might suggest simulating the ...If possible, then, I might suggest simulating the opening breath attack and subsequent breath attacks as different attack forms, the former occurring once at the start of the battle and the latter occurring at most twice during the battle. I say this mainly because I find (from experience playing in map grids) that while a dragon can often get a well-aimed breath in while the PCs approach, during the thick of the battle it's nigh impossible to catch more than two PCs in a breath unless they're exceptionally numerous. The one exception is green dragons; the square cloud is devastating in close quarters. For all the rest, though, neither straight lines nor acute cones are especially conducive to hitting several targets that are spread out around you. With those sorts of areas of effect, I find that you can generally only hit one enemy if you don't move, and two or absolute max three if you reposition yourself to get the most advantageous angle - possibly braving several attacks of opportunity to do so, depending on edition.<br /><br />Though you're not currently running any morale checks other than dragon fear, I would still be interested in the future possibility of simulating the effect of undead immunities in monster vs. monster combat. Like, how big of a horde of skeletons does it take to kill a cornered dragon? How does a mummy fare against a giant scorpion? That sort of thing.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14285793254382192231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-70111007302957878742016-03-22T12:27:26.127-04:002016-03-22T12:27:26.127-04:00I love these predictions! A couple things that mig...I love these predictions! A couple things that might not be what you expected:<br /><br />- I did compare the Gorgon's breath to Dragon breath for details -- cone-shaped as in AD&D -- so it hits about half of the people around it by my take. But wow I love that fill-the-cave imagery.<br /><br />- Because of the haziness of the Fear in OD&D, I'm applying a bonus for HD (as above) that makes you immune once you're 4th level.<br /><br />- I totally wrestled with whether Vampire Charm is against one or many people. I actually came down on the only-one side, because the vampire "looking into their eyes" seems the inverse of the medusa's "those who look into its eyes", say. Maybe I'm reading too much into that (or I've got images from movies in my head). <br /><br />Do you actually apply Charm on a mass basis in your game, etc.?Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-40097998654716340062016-03-22T12:16:03.838-04:002016-03-22T12:16:03.838-04:00Interesting point about morale (which of course is...Interesting point about morale (which of course is a super gray zone any way you slice it); I'm not using any modifiers except what I wrote above (HD), which is likely to only effect low-level NPCs anyway (you're actually immune as of 4th level with the reaction-based mechanic above). I'm not otherwise implementing morale for groups in the simulator; while that could make a difference, in some sense the exercise is "how really powerful is everyone", which could then provide a better knowledge gauge about when you should run away (I suppose). <br /><br />To be clear, the Dragons here do still get 3 breath weapon attacks, because the book rule says they can still choose to do that when they're in melee. The only things that get the one-time limitation before melee are: Hurl Rocks, Tail Spikes, Gaze Attacks, and Fear. Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-38695790947257932852016-03-22T01:47:37.370-04:002016-03-22T01:47:37.370-04:00It feels like Gorgons underground represent a huge...It feels like Gorgons underground represent a huge breath weapon threat. Save or die, the gas fills the whole area. <br /><br />Fear causing people to run themselves off cliffs or separating the party so the dragon can approach the runners as 1:1 fights could easily be the worst if all that were implemented. <br /><br />Charm is really tough vs. multiple opponents, because each charmed target both removes an enemy and adds an ally. A Charm gaze that everyone must save against (instead of a Charm ability you have to target on someone) would probably wipe PCs the most regularly. <br /><br />Demihumans with resistances to these are a whole lot more valuable than human combatants. Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-74847832932688836942016-03-21T10:22:41.676-04:002016-03-21T10:22:41.676-04:00On the topic of multiple attacks, the hydra head l...On the topic of multiple attacks, the hydra head limitation actually makes a great deal of sense in the context of hex-based combat - the hydra can only attack with one head in each of the two frontal and two flank hexes, and isn't flexible enough to reach around to the two rear hexes. In any case, with randomized targets against a whole party, a hydra making more than four attacks against a particular target is really an edge case, only happening often when the strongest hydras face off against small parties.<br /><br />The amount of targets hit by the dragon's breath may be a bit high, but it's probably fair since you're only letting the dragon use it once instead of three times.<br /><br />The morale thing for dragons gets a little hinky because of the fact that PCs never have to take morale tests. Also, are you including any of the traditional morale modifiers, e.g., +1 for Lawful creatures and -1 for Chaotic ones? Undead as a category should be altogether immune to dragon fear, as well as to poison. Speaking of morale, are you including morale tests when 25% or 50% of a force is defeated? That was always a major part of game balance when adventuring parties fought against large bands of enemy humanoids.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14285793254382192231noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-60031859780889304102016-03-21T10:17:00.977-04:002016-03-21T10:17:00.977-04:00Your engagement rule is pretty reasonable, and the...Your engagement rule is pretty reasonable, and the free attack on retreat is by-the-book as I read (I'm one of the few people who <i>don't</i> do that). <br /><br />Good guess on the "most dangerous special attack". :-)Deltahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00705402326320853684noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-2170237526012357403.post-33090919107907929592016-03-21T06:02:41.399-04:002016-03-21T06:02:41.399-04:00Upon first contact I let the (N)PCs choose their m...Upon first contact I let the (N)PCs choose their melee targets as long as there is a clear path (so, no blockers on the way). Also, once in melee, I rule that disengaging from melee is particularly hard resulting (depending on circumstances) in a free attack by the opponent and/or may take a full round (prohibiting a swing at another target) and/or requires a dex and/or str check.<br /><br />The Dragon's breath weapon is very powerful, but since there is a cap on the total amount of victims, I think that the gaze attack (without such a cap) is in the long run the most dangerous one. Especially when coming in multiples, as a higher fraction of the party will be taken out of combat before round 1.pileshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06008654668836414680noreply@blogger.com